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Hi everyone,

This is going to be a long post, so you might want to get some coffee because this is going to take a while. Before I start...

"Lord will you be in charge and let your word and your truth go forth please? Lord dont let "me" get in the way and if anything I said is not of you, please let it fall on deaf ears. Thank you Lord for your spirit & your truth. In Jesus name, Amen."



Now Artur, you asked "Where is truth?" Well truth is seen when God's word is our set standard and we measure everything against it. We must be careful not to blur the lines of what is acceptable and what is not, hence we follow His word/s. Jesus said "heaven & earth will pass away, but me and my words will last forever". Yes, following Jesus' word is pretty important.

So while its true there is sin/flesh in everyone's life that Christ needs to deal with, we are still commanded to repent, be holy as God is holy, listen and obey Him alone. If we search the scriptures, in both OT & NT, we don't not see compromise when it comes to sin. There is no allowing it to reign in one's life, be it in the individual or corporate/bride of Christ setting - rather we are called to fight the good fight/run the race to win. We are either going forward or backward; there is no stagnant, lukewarm place where sin is to be tolerated - especially one that condones sin and false teaching, false prophesies, etc. Its no wonder we are called to "test everything & hold fast to what is good (& discard/keep away from what is bad)", "take captive every thought" and to "examine ourselves daily" so we can walk in righteousness before God and to "work out our salvation with fear and trembling". We need His word & discernment to determine if one's fruit is good or bad. If it is good, then continue serving, however if it is bad, rebuke and correction is called for. If that rebuke and correction are not heeded, then we are to have nothing to do with them that persist in producing bad fruit.

Due diligence:
What I find interesting is that most Christians spend more time thoroughly checking the details and particulars of the jobs we want, vacations we take, cars we drive & even the movies we watch. However when it comes to checking & testing ministries and their fruit, we seem to check our heads & hearts at the door. IOW most blindly follow anyone that is a "Christian" author, pastor, priest, prophet, etc. We have come to think discernment is to only be applied to the lost world and not those that profess to be brethren BUT... if you look at the biblical context, we are to look out for false teachers & false prophets that ARE ALREADY IN the church. With that said…

Lets test some specific fruit:
The bible has definite standards as to what's acceptable and what's not. When we look at IHOP & sister ministries, we see lots of problems generally categorized, as "doing what they think is right (and that leads to death)", instead of doing what God says. Lets look at one area Mike Bickle/IHOP focuses and teaches… prophecy, and compare it to scripture and see what kind of fruit is produced and promoted.

Now why did I pick 'prophecy'? Look at what Paul said in 1 Corinthians 14:1…
"Pursue love, yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but ESPECIALLY that you may PROPHESY."

Now we know prophecy is only for believers (1 Cor 14:22) and its one of the greater gifts. However if its misused &/or false prophecies are given it can be an even greater threat because it can infect the body like a virus and do great damage if it is not checked and stopped early on.

Disclaimer
I am only using IHOP because Artur's initial post mentioned it. However no matter the ministry or man, we need to test everything & everyone, seek God, listen and do what He tells us. I love everyone and pray God will draw all men to Himself. I have no axe to grind with IHOP, just being real and applying God's word the way He tells us we should.


False prophecies
Scripture is very clear about who is a false prophet - its one who makes a prophecy that does not come to pass (Deut 18:21-22 "And if you say in your heart, 'How may we know the word that the LORD has not spoken?' when a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word that the LORD has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously. You need not be afraid of him." Also check out 2 Pet 2:1-3, Matt 7:15-23, etc). Lets look at prophecy, test it/them against scripture and see whether or not a ministry & its prophets are truly speaking what God tells them or not. If they are speaking truth, then it edifies the body. If it goes against scripture then we are to have nothing to do with it (if correction is rejected).

So lets look at IHOP and subject of prophecy…


Example #1:
Numerous prophecies are promoted and taught by Mike Bickle & IHOP today (via internship classes). Mike Bickle openly admitted that only a small number of their prophecies are actually from the Lord - yet they continue to give out more false prophesies. Here is a quote from Mike himself…

"We've been given 10,000 prophecies, and I believe there's ONLY A SMALL NUMBER that I've really cherished in my heart AS FROM THE LORD. So do we get mad at the people that gave the other ones? No. WE JUST LET THEM GO -- just set them on the shelf and just let their… let them go on down the river… because there's showy people, because there's proud men and women. We don't throw out the gift".

Ummm… that should raise a red flag if we hold to God as our standard, right? Yes.

End Result:
So IHOP continues to promote & condone false prophecies, which are in direct conflict with scripture. To let them 'go' unchecked with no rebuke or correction because they are "proud"? What is that? Last time I checked the standard set by God was never rescinded, changed, nor was it flexible for those who are/were "proud". So is this any way for a believer, teacher and leader of prophets to conduct themselves? The answer is "No."


Example #2:
Another disturbing statement by Mike Bickle/IHOP is that having numerous false prophecies is now acceptable to God (but not during biblical times - which is in direct conflict that God is the same, yesterday, today and forever). What was sin in the OT, and the NT, is still sin today. In a statement regarding their numerous false prophecies, which Mike acknowledged that there were many false prophecies (mistakes they called them) and said "Well, that's better than it's ever been up to now, you know, that's the highest level it's ever been." Mike has also been quoted as excusing numerous false prophecies (their past prophecy success rate averages around 60-65%, with one of their 'prophets' only having a 10% success rate) with "Babies are messy & they make messes".

What? You have got to be kidding me.

I missed the part in the bible that says there are 'baby prophets' & its okay when they make messes (make numerous false prophecies). Implying that its ok to have false prophecies due to the immaturity of prophets is wrong; no where in scripture is this ever found or implied, rather its clearly condemned by God and His word. This too should raise a red flag if we hold fast to God and His word.

End Result:
It's sad when the leadership of IHOP, or any Christian/organization, continues to promote (false) prophecies that conflict with scripture. In light of the numerous false prophecies there is still no rebuke or correction given to these so-called prophets nor have they publicly apologized and repented. No one saying before the body "I was wrong, sorry about that, its time for me to repent and seek God" or "I need to step down for a while…" or anything similar. Rather its excused away with terms like "messes", "mistakes", "errors" & "babies". If these people are so immature in the Lord, then perhaps they should not be in the position they are in - sure that might be called to that office, but its obvious that much more maturity is required. After all doesn't scripture show that those who are mature in the Lord are to serve? Yes. However they ignore many important scriptures and instead use the bible like a buffet of "pick and choose" theology, instead of following Jesus Christ in word, thought and deed. Is this anyway to follow Jesus Christ or God's word and 'minister' to His body? Again the answer is a simple "No."


So what are we to do?
In the OT false prophets were stoned/killed. In the NT they are to be publicly exposed, rebuked & corrected but this is not happening, or being received by some folks at IHOP. Instead we hear excuses and a continuation of "doing what they think is right". Mike has been quoted about confronting false prophets in his group saying of one that…

"Only 60% of his prophecies come true and he is a problem to me. I had to sit him down, and I don't let him prophesy"

However shortly after this Mike Bickle allowed Charisma Magazine to print that this '40% failing prophet in question' that...

"… his track record has earned him a place of honor at Grace Ministries (KCF)".

Question, how can a prophet that fails 40% of the time and told to not prophecy anymore by its leader, be lifted up in a place of honor in regards to prophecy? That doesn't make any sense, hence another red flag. If we follow the scriptures, this is not to be so - the word tells us to "let your yes be YES and our no be NO; anything other than that is from the evil one" (Matt 5:37 & James 5:12). So in light of just this one area, IHOP and prophecy, we see a clear departure from scripture and the teachings we ALL are to follow as believers, regardless of position.


Correction & rebuke cuts both ways:
With all the false prophesies, where the majority are never dealt with according to scripture, we also see a misuse of biblical correction and rebuke within IHOP. We all know scripture is useful for teaching, correcting, rebuking and training in righteousness and its applicable to ALL believers (2 Timothy 3:16). There is to be no partiality among believers (1 Tim 5:21 & James 2:9). Yet we do not see this within IHOP and some of its sister ministries. Its very clear IHOP rebukes and corrects others they deem "in grievous sin/s against God", but when the same scriptures and standards are applied to them in their "error/s" they cry 'foul' despite the scripture showing otherwise. Instead of it being 'sin' its called an "error", "mistakes" or "messes". Ummm… again this sounds fishy to me.

So what's worse?

IHOP has rejected those who have tried to bring clear biblical correction. Instead they were ignored and/or maligned because they "choose to attack 'God's anointed movement'". It should be noted that the often misused "touch not God's anointed' is taken out of context - originally it was about the entire nation of Israel and that the pagan nations were to "touch not God's anointed" - IOW it was applied to the body as a whole and not to just a select number of leaders/prophets so they could maintain & lord control over fellow brothers & sisters in Christ (He is our King). Nowhere in scripture is a rebuke to be refused and not taken into consideration. Matter of fact a godly man or woman of God will encourage people to rebuke and correct them if there is any perceived sin, so as to keep them from straying from the narrow path. This is even more important for prophets, teachers & preachers who are warned about causing little ones to stumble (Matt 18:6). God does not allow leaders to continue in sin (false prophecy, immorality, etc) because of their position; rather we see the opposite. God actually holds His leaders, priests & prophets to a higher standard. If it gets too bad, God says He will turn them over to their fleshly desires & a great delusion. Ouchie!

Now God's word says He disciplines those He loves, but when you ignore rebuke and correction are you not in fact ignoring and disobeying God? Yes, and that is a bad place to be in. All who are called by God and love Jesus are commanded to obey and follow Him in spirit and IN TRUTH. When we start going our own way, man/we make up things to stay in control. One area in which most people will not often question or test, is the area of prophecy. Not sure why, but I am pretty sure the enemy has his hand in this lie.


So my questions are…

How much compromise (sin, false teaching/prophecy) do we allow in our lives or into the corporate body/bride of Christ?

Is not His word extremely clear about such matters, about how just a little bit of leaven ruins the whole batch and what we are to do?

These are hard questions for some, but scripture says we are to follow God and that He will judge us for every word, thought and deed. If we believe scripture and that everything is for His glory, then if we make false prophesies are we not essentially stealing His glory? If we condone and do not expose the false prophets according to scripture are we not also accountable for being disobedient? Yes, and that is why it's imperative to listen and obey God (and not Mike, Doug, me or anyone else - Jesus has been given all power and authority and He is the Head of the body).


For me I follow the path as seen throughout the bible & I pray God will keep me on the straight and narrow & kill anything in me that gets in His way. It hasn't always been that way in my life, but God has been merciful to me and I don't deserve it. He is the one that brought me to my knees in repentance. With that said, I cannot make anyone change, only God and His Holy Spirit can bring conviction and change in a person's heart be they prophet, priest or king. I just hope you pray earnestly, search the scriptures and bring this matter before the Lord, and walk in His righteousness.

Keep seeking God, listen & obey Him.


Love,

Steve


p.s. Can we honestly say we have done our homework when it comes to checking out these IHOP prophets (or any other person or ministry)? Have we asked for God to give us discernment and compared what these men/women say against scripture? The majority have not.

Personally I have found some speakers & teachers at/with IHOP who deny the trinity, deny that hell is real, & those who get guidance and direction from long dead saints despite the bible specifically prohibiting/condemning anyone to communicates with the dead (Deuteronomy 18:9-12, Lev 19:31, 20:6, 1 Chron 10:13). So am I saying everything or everyone in IHOP (or any other ministry) is wrong? No, just that we need to be really attentive to God and His word, to be obedient and test everything! If we are to be the spotless bride of Christ, we need to be obedient.

So in light of this "fruit" we have found, we really need to seek God, listen & obey Him.

1 Peter 4:17-19 "For it is time for judgment to begin with the household of God; and if it begins with us first, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God? And if it is with difficulty that the righteous is saved, what will become of the godless man and the sinner? Therefore, those also who suffer according to the will of God shall entrust their souls to a faithful Creator in doing what is right."